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You Asked: I Don't Believe She Was Raped

You Asked: I Don't Believe She Was Raped

Dear Sugar,

My friend tends to get a little touchy feely with guys when she gets drunk. She has a boyfriend that she has been dating for almost three years who is studying abroad in Italy. Recently she got drunk, invited a guy over, and they had sex. She is really upset about what happened, and her boyfriend is being amazingly understanding, however I'm having a problem being as sympathetic. She is telling almost anyone who will listen the story and she's saying that the guy she invited over raped her.

I know he could have stopped it from happening, but so could she, and knowing her past I am almost certain she is the one who initiated everything. I don't want to hurt her feelings and make her think I don't feel for her, but this isn't the first time she drunkenly cheated on her boyfriend. It's also not the first time she has had drunken sex and claimed the guy raped her. I don't know what to do. How do I deal with this sort of issue?

— Skeptical Sasha

To see Dear Sugar's answer

.

Dear Skeptical Sasha,

Regardless of whether or not she's telling the truth, your friend is putting herself in very dangerous situations, and I can understand why you're feeling upset. Unfortunately, this is a tricky topic. Rape is an extremely serious allegation, and thus should be dealt with equal severity, although it sounds as if your friend isn't reporting this to the police or seeking emotional support from a professional source. Of course this could be the case because her allegations are untrue. Either way, her behavior is very self-destructive, but any attempt to question her story will only make you appear judgmental and uncaring.

I still think you should tell her that you're worried. Direct your concern at her unsafe choices and stay away from accusing her of lying. Be clear that you want to help her any way that you can, but you won't support her behavior when she's drinking anymore. Recommend that she starts seeing a therapist to figure out why she's letting random men into her home. If she knows that you're genuinely worried about her, she might be more receptive to your input. Good luck!

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sunshowers83 sunshowers83 8 years
...and wiciltd, it's because of people like YOU that victims of rape and sexual assault are too afraid to come forward and report these crimes. It's because of people like YOU that many rapists will never see the inside of a courthouse, let alone a jail cell. It's because of people like YOU that genuine victims of rape will suffer alone and in silence and in perpetual fear of their rapists because they know that people like YOU will make all sorts of cruel and ignorant assumptions and judgments about their character and intelligence.Can't you see that you're part of a vicious cycle? Yes, I agree that it would be unwise to get drunk with a strange man, and that it's not a good idea to walk down an alley alone at night. I myself take great precautions to never find myself in these situations. But as long as we continue to blame the victims of these crimes, we are only HELPING THE CRIMINALS to get away with it by shaming their victims into silence. You may think your attitude empowers women, when in REALITY (a word you seem fond of) you're actually empowering these predators. I'm sure you don't realize that your logic is prejudiced against men as well. By taking the "Hey, she was asking for it, and boys will be boys, and that's just the way it is" approach, you're also making some dangerous and unfair assumptions about men. You're basically suggesting that given the opportunity, all men could potentially become rapists. Well, have more faith in the other gender than that - I know plenty of guys who think it's absolutely reprehensible to take advantage of a drunk girl, even if she did put herself in that state. Men DO have a choice, it is ENTIRELY their choice, and any real man understands this and owns it, and knows that only a cowardly weasel would use the excuse, "But she was asking for it." A woman who has had too much to drink hasn't committed any crime - maybe she made a mistake, but so have we all. If she is raped, it is the MAN who made the choice to do so, a choice that she had NOTHING to do with. And if it happens more than once, then she might not be the quickest learner - hell, let's even come right out and call her stupid, dumb, moronic, but STILL the fact remains that no crime was committed until the man made the choice to take advantage of her. I hope I didn't come across too harshly, because I used to think like you too. I did, until I started studying these issues in university and I was horrified to realize that I was part of the problem. Well, no more. And I commend snowbunny and Stareosaurus for arguing so passionately about this issue, because the level of ignorance regarding rape is outrageous.
sunshowers83 sunshowers83 8 years
...and wiciltd, it's because of people like YOU that victims of rape and sexual assault are too afraid to come forward and report these crimes. It's because of people like YOU that many rapists will never see the inside of a courthouse, let alone a jail cell. It's because of people like YOU that genuine victims of rape will suffer alone and in silence and in perpetual fear of their rapists because they know that people like YOU will make all sorts of cruel and ignorant assumptions and judgments about their character and intelligence. Can't you see that you're part of a vicious cycle? Yes, I agree that it would be unwise to get drunk with a strange man, and that it's not a good idea to walk down an alley alone at night. I myself take great precautions to never find myself in these situations. But as long as we continue to blame the victims of these crimes, we are only HELPING THE CRIMINALS to get away with it by shaming their victims into silence. You may think your attitude empowers women, when in REALITY (a word you seem fond of) you're actually empowering these predators. I'm sure you don't realize that your logic is prejudiced against men as well. By taking the "Hey, she was asking for it, and boys will be boys, and that's just the way it is" approach, you're also making some dangerous and unfair assumptions about men. You're basically suggesting that given the opportunity, all men could potentially become rapists. Well, have more faith in the other gender than that - I know plenty of guys who think it's absolutely reprehensible to take advantage of a drunk girl, even if she did put herself in that state. Men DO have a choice, it is ENTIRELY their choice, and any real man understands this and owns it, and knows that only a cowardly weasel would use the excuse, "But she was asking for it." A woman who has had too much to drink hasn't committed any crime - maybe she made a mistake, but so have we all. If she is raped, it is the MAN who made the choice to do so, a choice that she had NOTHING to do with. And if it happens more than once, then she might not be the quickest learner - hell, let's even come right out and call her stupid, dumb, moronic, but STILL the fact remains that no crime was committed until the man made the choice to take advantage of her. I hope I didn't come across too harshly, because I used to think like you too. I did, until I started studying these issues in university and I was horrified to realize that I was part of the problem. Well, no more. And I commend snowbunny and Stareosaurus for arguing so passionately about this issue, because the level of ignorance regarding rape is outrageous.
Kristinh1012 Kristinh1012 8 years
At this point I'm starting to wonder if it really matters what you think about the situation. This is someone that you don't think of as too much of a friend. It actually seems to me like you don't even like her the way you talked about her in your post. Which is fine, but you shouldn't be associating yourself with her if that's the case. Obviously she makes bad decisions regardless. But only her and the man she went home with will really know what happened. The very fact that this happened to her and she's running around telling a kinds a people about it seems to be enough of a reason not to want to associate youself with her. She seems like a self destructive person.
Kristinh1012 Kristinh1012 8 years
At this point I'm starting to wonder if it really matters what you think about the situation. This is someone that you don't think of as too much of a friend. It actually seems to me like you don't even like her the way you talked about her in your post. Which is fine, but you shouldn't be associating yourself with her if that's the case. Obviously she makes bad decisions regardless. But only her and the man she went home with will really know what happened. The very fact that this happened to her and she's running around telling a kinds a people about it seems to be enough of a reason not to want to associate youself with her. She seems like a self destructive person.
Jessie-M Jessie-M 8 years
Situation #1- She was raped, and isn't lying. You are so iffy about her honesty that you are doubting she was raped at all-distance yourself from this friend. In her situation she does not need a friend in her life doubting the pain she went through.Situation #2- She is lying, and you are right for doubting her. Distance yourself from her-you don't need that kind of crazy b*tch in your life-what kind of friend can she be if she is so willing to lie about something like rape?So, either way, I would distance yourself from this friend. You either aren't helping her by doubting her in her time of need, or she isn't doing you any favors by lying about something this huge.Personally, I find it a tad suspicious that she is broadcasting it and am leaning towards thinking she is lying, but it may just be her way of dealing with it. So again, we weren't there, we dont know what actually happened, so I wouldn't make any confrontations with her demanding to know 'the truth'.
Jessie-M Jessie-M 8 years
Situation #1- She was raped, and isn't lying. You are so iffy about her honesty that you are doubting she was raped at all-distance yourself from this friend. In her situation she does not need a friend in her life doubting the pain she went through. Situation #2- She is lying, and you are right for doubting her. Distance yourself from her-you don't need that kind of crazy b*tch in your life-what kind of friend can she be if she is so willing to lie about something like rape? So, either way, I would distance yourself from this friend. You either aren't helping her by doubting her in her time of need, or she isn't doing you any favors by lying about something this huge. Personally, I find it a tad suspicious that she is broadcasting it and am leaning towards thinking she is lying, but it may just be her way of dealing with it. So again, we weren't there, we dont know what actually happened, so I wouldn't make any confrontations with her demanding to know 'the truth'.
raisinette raisinette 8 years
I wanted to add one point. Please be careful if you encourage your friend to report her suspicions to the police. As mentioned in some of the comments above, this action can have disastrous effects on an individual's life. Claiming another person is a rapist, whether it turns out to be true or not, will permanently impact the life of that person. I do think that of all of these suggestions, encouraging your friend to find additional support (therapy, advice from other victims, etc.) seems like a very good option. Hope you can figure this situation out.
raisinette raisinette 8 years
I wanted to add one point. Please be careful if you encourage your friend to report her suspicions to the police. As mentioned in some of the comments above, this action can have disastrous effects on an individual's life. Claiming another person is a rapist, whether it turns out to be true or not, will permanently impact the life of that person. I do think that of all of these suggestions, encouraging your friend to find additional support (therapy, advice from other victims, etc.) seems like a very good option. Hope you can figure this situation out.
Marci Marci 8 years
Women like your friend make it so much harder for women who actually ARE raped.
wiciltd wiciltd 8 years
Stareosarus - I won't walk around with my head in the sand and live in this happy little bubble that because it shouldn't happen it won't.. And I agree - no one deserves to be raped.. I know the scars it can leave and how it can effect someone for life... Which is why I would go out of my way to be safe.. I live my life in REALITY.. This place where violence happens, rape happens, murder happens.. And I won't allow myself to be an easy victim.. And these people are making choices.. They're CHOOSING to get shit faced beyond words without a safety net.. and end up going home with some guy - something that never would have happened if they were sober.. You have to live your life in the real world, not in what oyu think the real world should be
farrenista farrenista 8 years
that's a tricky situation. =/ but, it does seem iffy if this isn't the first time shes cried rape.
Stareosarus Stareosarus 8 years
Your thinking leaves people who are hurt in these cases as guilty, wiciltd, a guilt they already have to carry for the rest of their natural lives. A guilt that they shouldn't have to live with because it is NOT their fault. Stop perpetuating the "Blame the victim!" mentality, it does more harm to everyone involved than it will ever do good.Yes, women rape men. Women rape women, and men rape men too. Does that mean the victim is in the wrong because the genders can be moved around? No. Does the victim need to shoulder guilt because they were drunk, on drugs, or out late at night? No, never. Because these things can happen anywhere, and at any time, and to anyone. Your "common sense" doesn't mean anything in this case, because you SHOULD have the right to walk out at night in pasties and a thong and not have anyone put their hands on you. Do I advocate that? No, because bad things happen and the courts throw it back on the victim rather than the party that took their sense of self, and destroyed their life.And in that case, if you believe I'm the problem still, I'd rather that than be part of your solution.
Stareosarus Stareosarus 8 years
Your thinking leaves people who are hurt in these cases as guilty, wiciltd, a guilt they already have to carry for the rest of their natural lives. A guilt that they shouldn't have to live with because it is NOT their fault. Stop perpetuating the "Blame the victim!" mentality, it does more harm to everyone involved than it will ever do good. Yes, women rape men. Women rape women, and men rape men too. Does that mean the victim is in the wrong because the genders can be moved around? No. Does the victim need to shoulder guilt because they were drunk, on drugs, or out late at night? No, never. Because these things can happen anywhere, and at any time, and to anyone. Your "common sense" doesn't mean anything in this case, because you SHOULD have the right to walk out at night in pasties and a thong and not have anyone put their hands on you. Do I advocate that? No, because bad things happen and the courts throw it back on the victim rather than the party that took their sense of self, and destroyed their life. And in that case, if you believe I'm the problem still, I'd rather that than be part of your solution.
wiciltd wiciltd 8 years
Stareosarus it's people like you that are the problem.. and are at the root of what I am saying Sure it'd be nice to go lalala all through life and think to yourself because it shouldn't happen it won't Fact of the matter is - IT DOES HAPPEN.. So use some common sense.. Women and men should have the right to walk through a dark park, a dark alley late at night with no recourse.. But fact of the matter is we live in a society where that's just not possible anymore..Be it rape, muggings, or falling down and hurting yourself and having no one there to help you.. And no amount of positive thinking is going to change this fact.. And don't put this on men, women rape men as well but most guys won't speak out about it..
trésjolie1 trésjolie1 8 years
As much as "real" rape can destroy a woman, "fake" rape can destroy men. If you have been raped before I highly doubt you would act as the girl described in the post. And I think women should be able to dress however they see please, and have guy friends and so on; but this isn't about that. Some people lie, and ruin other peoples lives to look better. It creates suspicion against true victims of rape, and makes it harder to put rapists in jail. If there is a pattern of reckless behavior and misrepresentation, which is how I read it, I would do as Dearsugar suggests and tell her to go get help.
bellydancinmary bellydancinmary 8 years
Tell her what lilavati said: reporting it, seeking help, etc. If everything turns out to be true, then stick with your friend, she's going to need someone. If not, then she obviously has other problems and ditch her.
Stareosarus Stareosarus 8 years
"You walk through a dark park late at night alone.. and you get attacked.. I am sorry.. That's partly your fault.. You should have some freakin common sense"No. Absolutely not. Women have just as much right to walk where they want to at what time they want to without having to fear for their safety. We do, regardless, but it's men who make us fear.And to the OP, if she was raped, different women display different emotions post-rape. You never know, and if you accuse her of lying it will be a Pandora's Box. She may not want to report to the police because she may have guilt over it (Just because you talk about it to friends, doesn't mean you don't still have underlying guilt).Therapy is the best option, and if she's afraid to go to a councilor alone or doesn't want to, offer to find a rape support group in town and go with her.
Stareosarus Stareosarus 8 years
"You walk through a dark park late at night alone.. and you get attacked.. I am sorry.. That's partly your fault.. You should have some freakin common sense" No. Absolutely not. Women have just as much right to walk where they want to at what time they want to without having to fear for their safety. We do, regardless, but it's men who make us fear. And to the OP, if she was raped, different women display different emotions post-rape. You never know, and if you accuse her of lying it will be a Pandora's Box. She may not want to report to the police because she may have guilt over it (Just because you talk about it to friends, doesn't mean you don't still have underlying guilt). Therapy is the best option, and if she's afraid to go to a councilor alone or doesn't want to, offer to find a rape support group in town and go with her.
wiciltd wiciltd 8 years
This is not in defense of men raping drunk women, this is in defense of stupid women getting drunk and then blaming men for it.. when they themselves should be accepting responsibility If you cannot handle yourself in public drunk.. then don't get drunk... It's that simple
snowbunny11 snowbunny11 8 years
Yeah, really, I mean, what are men supposed to do, NOT have sex with a woman just because she's too drunk to say no? Poor men, how would they EVER have sex if it weren't for date rape? They should even get bonus points in my book for using date-rape drugs or pushing an extra glass of champagne!We don't know what happened in this case, but it really disturbs me that this thread has turned into a defense of men raping drunk women. So, right, even if she was telling the truth, it was STILL her fault.
snowbunny11 snowbunny11 8 years
Yeah, really, I mean, what are men supposed to do, NOT have sex with a woman just because she's too drunk to say no? Poor men, how would they EVER have sex if it weren't for date rape? They should even get bonus points in my book for using date-rape drugs or pushing an extra glass of champagne! We don't know what happened in this case, but it really disturbs me that this thread has turned into a defense of men raping drunk women. So, right, even if she was telling the truth, it was STILL her fault.
wiciltd wiciltd 8 years
I am sorry But if you allow yourself to get drunk, and invite a strange man over to your house..be it yes or be it no it's still your fault.. And this twit is just making it worse for other women who are actually raped.. There are so many false cases that ruin mens lives because women don't want to accept responsibility for their actions.. I understand that it is sad that in our society women aren't as safe as they want to be.. But the fact of the matter is.. you should know better You walk through a dark park late at night alone.. and you get attacked.. I am sorry.. That's partly your fault.. You should have some freakin common sense Same as if you get drunk beyond words and you end up having intercourse.. I don't care if you didn't want it to happen.. Fact of the matter is you allowed yourself to get into that situation accept the consequences..
snowbunny11 snowbunny11 8 years
Karlotta- You said, "that she'd drunkenly cheated on her BF several times, and that she'd claimed it was raped a few of those times. "Really, where is that, the poster actually said:"but this isn't the first time she drunkenly cheated on her boyfriend. It's also not the first time she has had drunken sex and claimed the guy raped her." She didn't mention anything about "several." Your first impulse is to make it sound like this friend is even more of a whore than the poster made it sound. I think that is the issue that Kjonas and I are having. I mean, my gut reaction from reading this is that it is more likely than not that she wasn't raped, but we really don't know. When I complain about my friends, I tend to exaggerate, the poster COULD be doing that. If she were too drunk to make the decision whether or not to have sex, she was raped. This is regardless of whether or not she cheated on her boyfriend, had claimed to be raped before, willingly drank the alcohol, etc. Men know this, my fabulous guy friends "jokingly" complain about it all the time. The point is, we don't know and can't know what happened from this question, neither can the friend, and it's really disturbing that the women on here jump to villifying this friend as "attention-seeking." It's possible that she got incredibly wasted and raped. I don't condone cheating or drinking yourself to oblivion either, but I don't see why anyone would trust this random guy more than this random woman. Kjonas is right, we're women, so we should support each other, not call each other sluts. I don't have great advice for the poster either, if she is suspicious that she wasn't really raped, she needs to somehow make her friend understand how serious of an accusation that is without being seriously un-supportive if she really were raped. And, as Dear pointed out, even if she weren't raped, the friend has issues and needs help anyway. Yeah, it stinks to be sucked into a friend's drama, but really, no one is perfect and women need friends.
snowbunny11 snowbunny11 8 years
Karlotta- You said, "that she'd drunkenly cheated on her BF several times, and that she'd claimed it was raped a few of those times. " Really, where is that, the poster actually said: "but this isn't the first time she drunkenly cheated on her boyfriend. It's also not the first time she has had drunken sex and claimed the guy raped her." She didn't mention anything about "several." Your first impulse is to make it sound like this friend is even more of a whore than the poster made it sound. I think that is the issue that Kjonas and I are having. I mean, my gut reaction from reading this is that it is more likely than not that she wasn't raped, but we really don't know. When I complain about my friends, I tend to exaggerate, the poster COULD be doing that. If she were too drunk to make the decision whether or not to have sex, she was raped. This is regardless of whether or not she cheated on her boyfriend, had claimed to be raped before, willingly drank the alcohol, etc. Men know this, my fabulous guy friends "jokingly" complain about it all the time. The point is, we don't know and can't know what happened from this question, neither can the friend, and it's really disturbing that the women on here jump to villifying this friend as "attention-seeking." It's possible that she got incredibly wasted and raped. I don't condone cheating or drinking yourself to oblivion either, but I don't see why anyone would trust this random guy more than this random woman. Kjonas is right, we're women, so we should support each other, not call each other sluts. I don't have great advice for the poster either, if she is suspicious that she wasn't really raped, she needs to somehow make her friend understand how serious of an accusation that is without being seriously un-supportive if she really were raped. And, as Dear pointed out, even if she weren't raped, the friend has issues and needs help anyway. Yeah, it stinks to be sucked into a friend's drama, but really, no one is perfect and women need friends.
karlotta karlotta 8 years
I only called her promiscuous and whorish because the poster said herself that she got touchy feely with guys when she's drunk, that she'd drunkenly cheated on her BF several times, and that she'd claimed it was raped a few of those times. With that information on the table, I can't really bring myself to call her a fucking flower.
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