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House Defeats $700 Billion Financial Markets Bailout

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House Defeats $700 Billion Financial Markets Bailout The House on Monday defeated a $700 billion emergency rescue package, ignoring urgent pleas from President Bush and bipartisan congressional leaders to quickly bail out the staggering financial industry. Stocks plummeting on Wall Street even before the 228-205 vote to reject the bill was announced on the House floor. When the critical vote was tallied, too few members of the House were willing to support the unpopular measure with elections just five weeks away.

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justanerd1975 justanerd1975 8 years
LIl Rick, you need to read what I postd above and get a brush up on what Socialism is and how it began. Our country was founded by Christians, as a nation under God, and as a Socialist nation. Capitolism came much later on!
LiLRuck44 LiLRuck44 8 years
Socialism goes against everything our country was founded on, so I won't support it. I'm surprised that so many people on this board are for it!
justanerd1975 justanerd1975 8 years
LOL LilRick:) .... weren't our founding fathers Christians, though??? In what way is Capitolism founded on "In God we trust"? Socialism scares a lot of non-believers because here we would have interaction between the church and the state, not a supposed "seperation." Maybe then the government could help finance some of all those charity works it leaves to the church to deal with.... For those who are no familiar with the beginnings of Socialism: "On 10th April, 1848, a group of Christians who supported Chartism held a meeting in London. People who attended the meeting included Frederick Denison Maurice, Charles Kingsley and Thomas Hughes. The meeting was a response to the decision by the House of Commons to reject the recent Chartist Petition. The men, who became known as Christian Socialists, discussed how the Church could help to prevent revolution by tackling what they considered were the reasonable grievances of the working class. Frederick Denison Maurice was acknowledged as the leader of the group and his book The Kingdom of Christ (1838) became the theological basis of Christian Socialism. In the book Maurice argued that politics and religion are inseparable and that the church should be involved in addressing social questions. Maurice rejected individualism, with its competition and selfishness, and suggested a socialist alternative to the economic principles of laissez faire. Christian Socialists promoted the cooperative ideas of Robert Owen and suggested profit sharing as a way of improving the status of the working classes and as a means of producing a just, Christian society. The Christian Socialists published two journals, Politics of the People (1848-1849) and The Christian Socialist (1850-51). The group also produced a series of pamphlets under the title Tracts on Christian Socialism. Other initiatives included a night school in Little Ormond Yard and helping to form eight Working Men's Associations. In 1850 Thomas Hughes, Edward Neale, Lloyd Jones, and other members of the group helped to establish the London Cooperative Store. Disagreements between members resulted in the Christian Socialists being inactive between 1854 and the late 1870s. The 1880s saw a revival of the movement and by the end of the century a variety of Christian Socialist groups had been formed including the Socialist Quaker Society, the Roman Catholic Socialist Society, the Guild of St. Matthew, and the Christian Social Union. Christian Socialists also dominated the leadership of the Independent Labour Party formed in 1893. This included James Keir Hardie, Philip Snowden, Ben Tillett, Tom Mann, Katharine Glasier, Margaret McMillan and Rachel McMillan...." From Sparticus.com
LiLRuck44 LiLRuck44 8 years
I enjoy making decisions for myself, so I'll stick with Capitalism. Our founding fathers are turning in their graves right now.
justanerd1975 justanerd1975 8 years
America is the most prosperous nation~!~ and I agree, getting back to socialism would be a POSITIVE. It's funny how the republicans basically told the dem's oh no, you guys made this mess and then you tried to blame it on us, now you want us to help you get bailed out? Nope, lie in this bed that you made!!"
LiLRuck44 LiLRuck44 8 years
I would hardly consider America prosperous. Americans consume. Pretty lame, unprosperous role in the world if you ask me.
organicsugr organicsugr 8 years
It's about time we switched over to socialism. Isn't that how we rose to prosperity in the first place?
Jazz-Z Jazz-Z 8 years
Hallelujah to the end of capitalism...if in fact it is the end.
Michelann Michelann 8 years
LilRuck, it has been a slow, painful demise.
LiLRuck44 LiLRuck44 8 years
I think you're correct Michelin. Anyone care that we're witnessing the end of capitalism?
Michelann Michelann 8 years
Jill, the Federal Reserve played a great part in creating that bubble. That's what I was referring to in the first part of that comment. However, this bill was referenced in the second part where I said "You can try to keep inflating that bubble, but it's a losing battle. As long as that bubble exists, people will continue to make bad investments. The more bad investments, the worse the eventual crash." I believe this bill would only have prolonged the crash.
Jillness Jillness 8 years
Mich said: "If the credit market is distorted by government intervention, it's going to create a bubble, and sooner or later that's going to burst." " Federal Reserve keeping interest rates artificially low is exactly the 'government distortion' that I was referring to." But the bill isn't going to lower interest rates. The bubble is built on unknown risk (banks bundling mortgages to reflect less risk than what was there). I don't see how you can say that the bill would create a bubble.
justanerd1975 justanerd1975 8 years
and I was afraid they'd bail those jerks out
justanerd1975 justanerd1975 8 years
yay!!! cheer!! clap!!
LiLRuck44 LiLRuck44 8 years
You're welcome :)
Jazz-Z Jazz-Z 8 years
Thanks LiLRuck, that was a very informative link and certainly made a lot of sense. Whatever reason the bill didn't pass ~ being it logic or a pathetic reaction to a speech, it sounds like it was a fortuitous result.
LiLRuck44 LiLRuck44 8 years
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/29/miron.bailout/index.html?eref=rss_topstories
LiLRuck44 LiLRuck44 8 years
We didn't always live like we do now. We are self employed and have a few small businesses, we just didn't go into debt to start them up. There is an article just posted on CNN by Jeffrey Miron. I think he explains things really well, it'd be worth a read for everyone on this thread... if only for a different opinion.
Imabeliever Imabeliever 8 years
Lilruck44.. you bought your house and car for cash? You have no credit cards? You paid for all of your education yourself? You are an American oddity. Good for you. I personally went without a credit card until I was 30. I managed to not finance any large purhase until I purchased my first home at 32. But did manage to get myself into debt by starting 2 small business' Luckily since I am self employed I did not have money in a 401k or all that much in the stock market. Independent health insurance is the devil though it is so expensive. So God forbid the hubby or the kids get sick. But the economic failure of the US will hurt our small business.. we will have to see how badly since only time will tell.. the hubby and I might join the unemployed if we go belly up. We assume we could get jobs easily enough as we were both fairly successful in our office jobs..but with unemployment on the rise how many people will be competing with us for those openings? And of course full time child care for two kids under 5 will eat up almost all of my take home pay. The smartest thing we did over the last three years was rent a home vs buying when we moved across the country. We sold a beautiful home in SC and moved here to AZ. We moved here the same day as my brother in law.. they bought a house immediately for $750,000..three years later it is worth $325,000. YIKES.. glad we waited. Now all we have to worry about is the owner of the home we rent not paying his mortgage and getting foreclosed on..we would not have the slightest hint until the eviction notice is nailed to the door.. happening all over the valley these days. People making their rental payments on time and find out the home owner took the money and ran letting the home go into foreclosure.. you would think banks would appreciate existing renters and the revenue vs a home standing empty and depreciating..but no..they boot you with 30 days notice. Scary times folks.. good luck to all of you in the days, weeks and years ahead!
amybdk amybdk 8 years
Wow. What a day. I just want to go to bed, turn the lights off and hibernate until this is all over.
mydiadem mydiadem 8 years
Actually it isn't cool, the market crash is the first horse of the Apocalypse, right!?!
mydiadem mydiadem 8 years
Cool stuff, just curious.
Michelann Michelann 8 years
Mydiadem, the Federal Reserve keeping interest rates artificially low is exactly the 'government distortion' that I was referring to.
juju4 juju4 8 years
Lil-- the problem with that is that our country runs on loans and credit. The other day NPR was contrasting our country with China. They said on average the Chinese pay 90% of everything with cash. They pay rent in cash, they pay bills in cash, etc. But that is not the American economy. We take out car loans, home loans, we use credit cards,etc. I can't imagine that Americans are ready to buy everything (appliances, cars, homes, etc.) by paying 100% in full up front. and what is going to happen is that people are not going to be able to get the loans, and they are just going to stop buying things other than food and gas. and then our economy will really tank! I think the worst is still yet to come.
mydiadem mydiadem 8 years
My question for you Mich is what is the 'government distortion' you mention? I think it has more to do with the Fed wanting to keep interest rates low at any cost more so than legislation. And we are witnessing history folks - the Dow is currently on its highest single day loss ever!
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